Annie Seifullah, Esq. ’19 is an attorney with C.A. Goldberg, PLLC — a New York law firm that fights for victims of sexual assault, stalking, and blackmail — online and off.
On how you start your day:
I love my mornings. Especially during the pandemic. Because it is the ONLY time I get to myself. I wake up at 6 am and spend an hour all by myself. I go for a walk or listen to a podcast, while I clean up or do laundry. My only rules are no news and no email. Then my son wakes up about 7:30 or 8 am, and I drink coffee, eat breakfast, etc. with my son and partner before my work day officially starts.
On CUNY Law — why did you choose this school specifically?
CUNY Law was the only law school I applied to. I didn’t really want to be an attorney when I started. I thought it would be an affordable, progressive education and might allow me to expand my career options — since my previous career had come to a sudden halt and dead end. If I’m being honest, I applied on a bit of a whim. And, I’m so glad I did. Probably the best uninformed decision that I ever made!
On founding the Evening Student Law Association (ESLA) — what was the impetus for founding this association, and what benefits did you hope to share with fellow evening students? What was your core mission, and how did it bring balance to the evening student body?
Ah yes, I’m one of the “founding mothers” of the Evening Student Law Association. Is it still going? I hope so!
The impetus for founding ESLA was the extreme need for voice and perspective when it comes to planning for the Evening program. (We thoughtfully rejected the term “part-timers” and called ourselves Evening Students, because we were taking 10 and 11 credits some semesters, which is NOT part-time — but I understand the law school has to call it a part-time program because of ABA designations of some sort.)
I was in the first cohort of evening students, and we were guinea pigs. All of the staff and faculty were so enthusiastic about the program and about us existing as part of the CUNY Law student body — but, as the first class, we definitely felt the bumps that were being worked out along the way. The needs of the evening students are just SO different from daytime students. So, it was important to have a group of student representatives who could speak up and advocate.
Speaking of balance, you were President of the Parents Attending Law School (PALS) group while attending law school. Can you talk a little about this group, and, more broadly, about how you balanced parenting with law school studies?
I was a single mom while going to law school. It was, well… an adventure, that’s for sure. My son Khalil was 4 years old when I started the program, and, more than once, my babysitter cancelled, and I schlepped him to class with me. Looking back, I am sort of stunned at how my son and I survived the experience unscathed.
PALS was an incredible group — all working parents, many single parents like me. Due to the limitations on our time, we couldn’t organize on a large scale or even hold regular meetings. But, the informal support that we all provided for each other was priceless. We shared outlines and sometimes shared babysitters! It was a great experience.
Annie and her 10-year-old son Khalil
Is there anything you know now that you wish you knew in law school that would have brought more balance to your life?
I think in law school there is a sort of unhealthy “fad” that involves always being stressed, always expressing how impossible everything is, always feeling unworthy and stupid, and behind on work. I wish that I knew then that everything was fine and that everything would work out. And that all of that stress happening around me all the time (some real, some perceived, some performative) was not a necessary part of developing as a lawyer.
Real talk — how do you actually feel about the bar exam, and how was your experience overall? What got you through?
Real talk? The bar exam is abusive and has absolutely zero to do with your quality as a lawyer or as a human. So much is put on the arbitrary obstacle that does not prepare you for being a public interest or anti-violence advocate. I look forward to the day when the bar exam is not a thing. But I digress.
By the time the bar exam came around, I had enough perspective on law school experience to know that I did NOT want to give into the idea that the bar exam study would ruin my life. I remember in CORE we had recent grads visit and talk about their bar exam experience. And, it was awful! They talked about getting depressed and fat and stressed and breaking up and how bar exam prep was the worst eight weeks of their life.
I decided that I was going to make it the best eight weeks. Which it wasn’t. But, I was able to avoid allowing the bar exam prep to ruin my life. I aimed for minimum competency (it is an exam of minimum competency after all), and I just did my best everyday. I got up early and went for a jog or lifted weights. I ate a strict diet of “brain food” (salmon, blueberries, turmeric) and just tried to make the best of it.
The pressure of the bar exam is inhuman, so you should try not to let it dehumanize you. I guess I tried to make both of those things be true.
You went through an incredibly public/forward-facing, life-altering legal battle that played out against the backdrop of misogyny and stigma in an environment of victim-blaming and discrimination. This is unfortunately the context in which many survivors must fight, and some do not come forward because fighting for justice in this context is exhausting, it increases vulnerability, and it’s often continually retriggering without support. Now you’re empowering other survivors using law as a tool of change and healing. How do you hold space for and find balance between your own experiences and the experiences of clients in navigating the personal and professional divide? Is that divide even always necessary?
Oh man, what a thoughtful and empowering question! Thank you for validating and acknowledging the life-altering misogyny and stigma of what I went through.
My boss, Carrie Goldberg, and I both hold a firm belief that advocacy is the best form of therapy. (I mean, I also go to therapy — haha.) But, being able to help someone else in crisis, to sit with them through the struggle, to advocate for them in the legal system, and to provide them perspective and support from the survivor-lens — it’s just beyond words what joy and purpose that gives me. The legal system is also violence, so being able to act as a healer in the legal system is sort of a magical gift.
Of course, I do have to put my work down and attend to myself and my family, and be aggressive about boundaries for my own self-care. It’s a tricky balance. But, it’s necessary. Being obsessed about work to the point where I am ignoring all else makes it so that I can’t be as effective at work. I am super lucky to work for a woman-owned law firm. The culture of self-care and healthy boundaries is embedded in our firm and that makes a huge difference.
Annie and her firm C.A. Goldberg, PLLC
What do you do to support your own self-care when you’re not working? How do you balance the demands of work/parenting/mentoring/educating with time for just you?
My morning routine is extremely important to me. Getting up early and giving myself a quiet hour before the hustle and bustle starts has been a really effective strategy for me. And, I try to be religious about getting 30 uninterrupted minutes with my son at bed time — no matter what. I am an admitted workaholic. But, carving out the bookends of my day really makes a difference.
You’ve come full-circle from student to teaching Civil Procedure this summer. What were you most excited for this past summer, and what did students learn in your class?
When I took Civ Pro in law school, I just did not get what it was, why it mattered, and how to apply the learning to real-life lawyering. Once I was actually representing a plaintiff in a federal police misconduct case, and I started using the FRCP to my client’s advantage, I was like WHOAAAAA. This is pretty awesome.
I was really excited to try and implement an experiential curriculum for the Civil Procedure class. Meaning that we learned how civil procedures worked by following the ‘story’ of a case. I wanted to try and bring an applicable and human element to Civ Pro, so that students could see how something that looks obnoxiously formal and impossible (FCRP and court rules) can actually be untangled and used to level the playing field when taking on powerful and resourced opponents.
Any parting words of wisdom for burgeoning lawyers that want to dive deeper into anti-violence advocacy? Where can they start, and what courses in your opinion would help foster a better understanding of the legal work ahead?
If you want to do anti-violence advocacy, it has less to do with coursework and more to do with what you do outside of class. I strongly suggest volunteering for the Courtroom Advocacy Project (CAP) because that is where I learned how to write and argue a family offense petition in pursuit of an order of protection.
If you are specifically interested in the intersection of tech and violence, I recommend checking out the work of NYC Cyber Sexual Assault Task Force (full disclosure, I’m the co-chair) and seeing the list of partner organizations. This is a great list of places to apply for an internship or volunteer on the weekends.
Where can students contact you? (email/social/other)
My email is annie@cagoldberglaw.com. I don’t do social media other than Twitter, where I snark a lot. @annieseifullah
Be sure to check out the latest #CareerConversations, where 3L Val Rigodon interviews Annie on her career and her time at CUNY Law.
